Which Voice Should You Listen To: Change Your Body, or Embrace It? – In Session with Marc David

Which Voice Should You Listen To: Change Your Body, or Embrace It? – In Session with Marc David

Marc David
Welcome, everybody. I’m Marc David, founder of the Institute for the Psychology of Eating. We’re back in the Psychology of Eating Podcast, I’m with James today. Welcome, James!

James
Hey, Marc, good to be here! Thanks for having me.

Marc David
Thanks, my friend. So, here’s the deal. If you’re tuning in for the first time to the podcast, James and I are meeting for the first time and the idea is to have a session together and see if we can make some good things happen in relationship with food and body. So, James, if you could wave your magic wand, and get whatever you wanted, when it came to relationship with food, body, weight – what would that be for you?

James
For me, that would be to number one stop giving into emotional eating. I will answer this way, to me, my therapist have this alter ego that’s within me, we call him Little Jimmy. And Little Jimmy loves Friday night pizza parties with ice cream, and pizza and all that junk food. And whenever there’s like an emotional trigger, he likes to come out and say I need attention and I need all that food. So I would love to be able to find a way to tell little Jimmy that adult James has things in control and adult James can control and make good food decisions. And Little Jimmy can come out to play when it’s time, right. So to be disciplined, to be able to tell little Jimmy that it’s okay. Because I have a certain weight goal, and we can talk about that. But I know it’s not forever. I just want to be disciplined enough to lose this little bit of weight that I’ve struggled with, we can get into that as well.

I feel like maintenance for me is pretty easy. I’ve been at the same weight, honestly, for most of my adult life, I haven’t really struggled with obesity or gaining a lot of weight, I’ve kind of just sat in this one little weight range. But there’s a goal that I’ve wanted to achieve and I’ve almost done it three times, and we can talk about that. But I would love to find a healthy relationship with food and I would love to find a way to get the body that I’ve always wanted. Lose this fat around my obliques, my lower back and my lower abs. And I will say this too, I had a recent revelation and it’s really beautiful. I just got back from Italy two weeks ago and while I was there I had enough time to really look at my life in a profound way. And when I came back, there’s this TV show I really love. It’s called Queer Eye, on Netflix. And what I love about that show is how they tell the people they work with that, you know, you’re fine as you are, you’re lovable, you’re good as you are, you don’t need to have this or that in order to love yourself. And after all the years of watching that show, I finally got the message. And since I’ve been back, I’ve been really practicing a lot of affirmations. You know, I am lovable, I love my body as it is. I’m worthy of love as I am right now. And I’ve really been feeding into that type of energy more than, there’s also been a very harsh inner critic, that I’ve been battling pretty much for most of my adult life as well. There’s a brutal inner critic that loves to tell me really hateful messages. And it’s been a lot of battle. But so the magic wand would help me find a healthy relationship with food. Help me to be more disciplined. Help me to realize that I’m really not missing out when I maybe delay gratification for specific foods and that it’s going to be okay.

Marc David
So, how much weight do you want to lose?

James
It is about, I don’t know, it’s relative I know but it’s about 15-20 pounds.

Marc David
15-20 pounds. And you want to lose it from a certain part of your body. You’re not just wanting to lose weight globally on your body.

James
Yeah, it’s where typically for men, you know, it’s that inner tube, I call it, from your obliques that middle section of your body. It’s kind of where it goes around mainly.

Marc David
Just help me understand in your mind. Where did you get the 15 or 20 pound notion that you think that there’s 15 or 20 pounds worth of extra body weight there.

James
So here’s how I know this. During the pandemic, one of the things that I’ve always wanted to do is to have what I call the lifeguard physique. I don’t want to be a bodybuilder, I don’t want to look like Arnold Schwarzenegger, I like that very gymnastic, lifeguard kind of physique. You know, very lean, very muscular, but not huge. So during the pandemic, I finally worked with this online trainer. And I lost that amount of weight three times. So in November 2020, I got down to 136. Then I gained that back. And then February 2021, I got down to 135. Gained it back again. And then, September 2021, I got down to 137. And when I took the photos on myself, which I was doing as part of the work with this trainer, I could see the way my body looked, and it was like, wow! One of my friends said, I look like an Olympian. And I felt good, and my clothes felt amazing. But what would happen is there’s an emotional event with each one of these losses, not the loss, but the weight gain. Me gaining it back. But that’s how I know it’s around this 135 weight range where I look the way I want to look, and I’m around 151-152 right now. So…

Marc David
How old are you?

James
50

Marc David
Are you in relationship?

James
No.

Marc David
And just, when did you start deciding I want to shape shift my body, I want this body to look different. When did that happen?

James
It’s been a long time! Probably decades. I’m totally okay sharing that I’m sober. I’m sober 21 and a half years off all drugs and alcohol. And I think that’s really when it started. So it’s been a while. And I’m by no means like, most people who see me tell me I look great, like all my yoga teachers that I practice with, people at the gym, but you know, I want a little bit more and I know I can do it. But I’ve really just struggled with this emotional eating. And it delays the goal and just keeps putting it out further and further in front of me.

Marc David
So I think I see the challenge that you’ve outlined. So here it is, I’ve had this way, I discovered this way that I could lose the weight. But then emotional eating comes in, and then the weight comes back. So like, how do I have my goal? How do I have the goodies? And it sounds like having the goodies means I’m not emotionally eating. And that’s going to take me to where I want to go. So we’re gonna get to that. But I still have a couple of questions to ask before I think I can be of use to you. So okay, you lose the weight. Three sentences or less: How do you lose that weight? When you’ve lost it three times, how did you do that?

James
I was waking up first thing in the morning and working out. I was getting 12,000 steps a day. And I was limiting the amount of what I call binges or cheat meals.

Marc David
And then you lose the weight. And then something happens. Something triggers you and you want some food.

James
Yes.

Marc David
Does anything particularly trigger you that you’ve noticed?

James
So the events that I have here, because I knew you’re gonna ask me so I was ready! The first time, I think it was around Thanksgiving, and I went insane on the holidays. So Thanksgiving came and I just never stopped. Then I lost it again. The second time, February 2021 there was a death of a friend of mine that just came sideways that I didn’t know she was sick and she passed away. And even now like the emotion comes up and it just really struck me by surprise and I turned to food for comfort there. And then the third time I was like so close. September 2021 I got laid off from my job and I was so close to the goal and then it was just like, well forget that. So I mean, these are pretty significant life events. I mean, except for Thanksgiving, I don’t know. But the other two were definitely huge life events that definitely. sidelined me.

Marc David
Yes, sure.

James
But just one little fine point, it can also be just a bad day at work too you know. Oh, I didn’t accomplish my goals at work, I feel bad. Let me soothe myself.

Marc David
So, what do you tell yourself? When you’re speaking to yourself, okay, I want to lose this weight. In fact, I’ve lost it before. And how do you tell yourself life’s gonna be different? What’s going to be different for you? How do you convince yourself that you even want to put in this effort to lose the weight? What’s the benefit for you? I want to do this because… I want to lose this weight because…

James
I want to lose this weight because this is for me, like a bucket list thing in life. I’ve always wanted to look that way. And, I think it’s an esteemable goal, it’s a worthy goal. And it’s not a goal for anyone else but me. I’m not wanting to look this way for a woman or anyone in my family. It’s for me. It really, truly, earnestly is for me. But there are benefits, you know. I think, like, if I go to the beach, and I want to get in the water and take off my T shirt, and just be like..

And I admire people who have achieved that goal, who have achieved that certain type of physique, because it’s not easy to do. If it was easy, everybody could do it. It takes a certain amount of discipline, and a certain amount of dedication to achieve that goal. So when I tell myself like, it’s an admirable goal. It’s like making, I don’t know, a million dollars or something, it’s like, there’s a lot of things that go into it to achieve it. And if you did it, then you have something you can display, like, I did it. And then also, I love to help other people, too. I teach yoga. I was a personal trainer, back in the day, if I could share anything with others to help them, I love doing that. I love to be a teacher and share with others. I don’t know if I’m hitting on the question exactly right, but that’s my answer.

Marc David
So it sounds like in my language, based on what I heard you say, if you achieve this goal, you will feel good about yourself. Like I achieved this goal. I shot for this target, I aim for it. I work for it, and I got it. And it’s a goal that I’m I’m saying I’m gonna feel good about myself.

James
Yes!

Marc David
So did you have those moments when you lost the weight? You lost the weight three times. Did you have moments where you said to yourself, damn, James, this feels good!

James
Oh, yeah, definitely! Oh, yeah. I saw the photos and when I see them now I’m like, how did I do that, wow!

Marc David
Okay, so let me just outline some of the pieces of the puzzle here and see if we can make some headway here. So, there’s this one piece of the puzzle, which is like, hey, I want to do this because this is for me, and it’s going to make me feel good about myself. And I have gotten there several times, at least in the last handful of years, and I did feel good about myself. So understandable goal.

Next, there is this piece in the background that’s been there for some amount of time called, the harsh critic. So when I’ve got a harsh critic, and I wake up every morning, it might as well be like another person in your bed. You wake up in the morning, and there’s somebody next to you going, Ah, you’re too fat. You got to lose weight here. You’re not good enough. Hey, you’re gonna be a lot happier if you lose this weight but right now, this isn’t good enough. So that critic as you said yourself is intense.

So, the challenge for me here in what your goal is, is that there’s a couple parts of you working towards that goal. There’s the part of you, I’m going to assume that is very pure, that’s like hey, I want to have a hotter body. I just want a hotter body. And that’s gonna make me feel good about myself! I understand that. We know many different things, that if we could have them, feel them, or experience them, we’re gonna feel good about ourselves.

And there’s this part of you, that’s a harsh critic. And if I’ve got a harsh critic, oftentimes, the only way to shut up that harsh critic, I think, is to do what that critic wants me to do. Y’all ain’t perfect! You better be perfect! Oh, my god, I gotta be perfect. You’re not making enough money! Oh, my God, I better need to make more money. Because if I make more money, I’ll shut up the bad critic, and then all the bad voices go away.

So I’m not sure, literally, I’m just not sure, who’s driving the goal here. Now granted, both those voices, I think are active. I just don’t know who’s more dominant. Because if that critic is more dominant, which it can be, then I’m taking action from a place of I’m not good enough. I gotta shut up this critic. And the only way I shut up this critic is to achieve my goal. But you know, something? When I got a critic who’s constantly talking, I’m gonna want to find a way to feel better in the moment. Because for you to have your ultimate weight loss goal, and the Ultimate Body, like that’s going to really shut up the critic. But you know, we got to be able to shut up the critic on any given day, sometimes, and one of the best ways we can feel pleasure and shut out the voices, at least temporarily, is to eat.

So it’s possible for you that yes, your emotional eating could be triggered by life events, intense ones that could be triggered by just a holiday dinner, like whoa, lots of great food, or just, you know, basic bad day at work and just want to eat. So it can also be triggered by you know, I’m not at my goal. I don’t feel good about myself. And it’s almost as if we’re more sensitive. We’re less resilient. Because that critic is so intense, that in the moment, it’s just easier to turn to food. And sometimes, it’s not even the critic that seems to be triggering it. Anything can trigger it, as you say. But oftentimes, lurking in the background is the critic. So that’s just something that I’m aware of. Hold on to that for a second, just trying to piece some things together….

So emotional eating. I’m a big fan of emotional eating. I just want you to know that. And what I mean by that is, you and I are emotional creatures.

We’re emotional people. And we happen to be eaters. And you put that together, we’re emotional eaters. So you know, you go out on a date. That’s an emotional eating affair. You’re at a celebratory dinner. That’s an emotional eating affair. You have emotion, you bring emotion to the table. Yeah, I could have a bad day at work. And if I make myself a good meal, or go to a favorite restaurant, I feel better. So feel bad, eat food feel better. There’s nothing inherently wrong with that. I think that’s important. Like, we’re emotional people. And the the opposite of emotional eating would be I think, unemotional eating, which doesn’t sound very fun. No. So we’re going to bring emotion to the table. And obviously, things can go south for us if eating is my only strategy to regulate unwanted emotions. Yeah, that’s when it becomes problematic. It’s like, oh, eating is my go to thing and that’s all I do. So yeah, if I don’t have anything else to help regulate myself, then I’m going to turn to food.

So what I’m saying is, I don’t know that emotional eating is the thing that gets in the way for you. I think it seems like it because Wait a second, here I am. I got the body I want and then Boom, I’m eating. So, really what’s happening there is in those moments, you don’t have other ways, yet, that are consistent for you to say, Okay, what else? What else can I do in this moment other than turn to food? So part of that I have found that people will often have most success in crossing over that bridge, like you, you talked about already that you’ve worked on in therapy, like, Hey, there’s this like, young party you that just like, Okay, I’m ready to party. I want my food. And I need to somehow communicate to this part of me that, oh, wait a second. Wait a second, wait a second. So who’s communicating to that other part of you?

And I think the person that has to communicate to that part of you, is for you, I want to use the king archetype. And the king archetype because here you are, you’re 50.

And 50 is when the king archetype, I believe, really takes hold in a man. It’s the decade where you are ready to sit on your throne more. Now, in my experience, the king archetype the king isn’t sitting around in his chair on his throne and saying, Hey, do y’all love me? Am I good enough? Is this okay? Did you see me eat that? Is my body okay? No, the king knows who he is. He’s gone through some life. He’s gathered some wisdom. And he’s secure in who he is. And from that place of security, he goes about his business and his business is essentially giving his gifts and connecting to the power and the mission and the purpose within him. So that’s to me a good king. Now, yeah, kings have fun. King wants to go on the hunt. King wants to have some excitement. King wants to do good things. King wants to work on himself. King wants to feel fit. Absolutely. That’s your prerogative. It’s your kingdom. That Kingdom starts in your mind. Kingdom of a man starts in his mind. So part of it is kind of surveying my mind looking at all the people in my kingdom, okay, here’s this little part of me, that likes the party and wants to reach for food. completely understandable, by the way. So it’s the king in you that has to talk to that part of you. And I think it would be helpful for you to define for yourself other than my goal with my body? What are the most important things in my life? If changing your body is the most important thing, chances are, it’s gonna be difficult for you.

And the reason why I say that is because it has been difficult for you. Harder to lose weight as we get older, harder to shape shift the body. You could do it, you could definitely do it! But it’s harder to shape shift the body as it gets older, it becomes a bigger ask. It takes more energy and effort. It just does, as you know. So it then takes a lot of lifeforce. Okay, well, if I want to do this, I got to be really on it with food, I gotta be on it with my emotional relationship with food. I gotta be on it with my fitness. And you don’t have to answer this question now. But I would ask myself the question, is that, really where I want to put all my energy? And what else? What else is there in life that’s more important than that? Now, if that’s the most important thing, then you got to marshal your forces. But I’m just calling into question, if that’s the most important thing. And the reason I call it into question is because body is an interesting cookie, you know, it has its own wisdom.

We want to have our way with the body. Body, I want you to do this. I want you to be muscular and strong and trim and lean. Yeah, I’m with you. Feel same way. Body, I want you to be healthy. Body, I want you to be disease free. I know what I want for my body. And quite frankly, I don’t want it to age, I don’t want it to die. Unless I say so. Yeah, we have less say in all those things than we think. We do have say in it but also times, it’s for these brief windows of time. You could eat the healthiest food in the universe, you could take care of yourself, like amazingly well, and still get a disease out of nowhere. So body’s a mystery the body dictates on its own terms.

So I’m just listening to your story. And I’m trying to put myself in the voice of your body, and I hear your body going. Okay, we’re gonna lose this weight, but then we’re gonna put it back on. I’ve heard and you’ve said, you know, you’ve been pretty consistent in your weight over the years. Your body has its place that it likes to hang out. Now, you know from experience that if you put in certain effort, you can make the body do something different. So you know that and it’s true, we can. And it’s a big ask of the body, if you want to create a very different body, from the body that your body tends to want to be. Your body tends to want to be the body that it is right now, that’s just its agenda. It’s no judgement. It’s just, this is what your body does. It’s not your preference. I get it. I don’t want my body to do this and I want it to do something else. It’s not doing this, what do I have to do? So I think what you’re discovering is that it’s hard work to get your body to where you want it to be. And I’m wanting you to leave here asking the question of Is that hard work worth it to me. So to really re examine, you know, you said you finally got the message from Queer Eye, which is you’re lovable!

I suspect that if you knew that you were lovable as you are the energy that goes into shape shifting your body to wanting it to be different, would be different. You’d still have your preference. So preferences are beautiful. They’re wonderful, I love them. It’s a matter of how much we take our preference and put it on our altar, and make it something that we worship and make it the most important thing ever in the world, which will save us and save us from our own self save us from our own critic. So that’s what’s kind of got my attention for you. You know, because I can I can say to you, okay, let’s just focus on emotional eating. And if we focused on emotional eating, then we would look at, you know, really helping yourself create strategies other than food that you can turn to. And then that becomes a practice.

So that’s the best way I’ve seen to unwind unwanted emotional eating. Is okay, take a cold shower, listen to music, watch funny videos, whatever it is you can do, make the phone call to a friend, do some deep breathing, do some yoga, put on some headphones, blast some music. So it’s learning those tricks, which is really advancing yourself and saying, Okay, I’m learning. I’m a learning growing human being. And I’m learning other ways to regulate my emotions, my unwanted emotions other than food. That takes its own kind of work. I think it’s good work. I don’t like emotional eating to the point where I don’t feel good. Or where I think oh, wow, wait a second. That’s gonna cause me to gain weight that I don’t want to gain so I don’t like that. So I have to look at ways okay, how do I regulate my emotions other than food….

But if that’s being driven by, if my motivation for working on my emotional eating is because my body’s not acceptable. I’m creating the conditions for emotional eating. You see what I’m saying? So the “my body is unacceptable” voice is kind of like lurking underneath, it can be very strong. So that’s, that’s kind of my take on what’s happening for you. And let me just pause there and see like, what’s what’s useful for you here? What’s landing for you? Any any thoughts that you’re having?

James
I think you nailed it. I think you’re, the inner critic, is very strong within me and has been for a long time. I’ve had the wins, but I think when you said that, when you were talking about achieving the body as being the penultimate goal for me, like, I think there’s a lot of truth in that. That’s been, I’ve been obsessed with it especially since the pandemic, you know, when I first lost the weight, it’s been an obsession, like, why can’t I do it? Everything you said just rings really true. Like, I don’t find anything within me, saying, No, that’s incorrect. So and kind of your conclusion I think is where I’ve been really, is the path that I feel has been emerging, which is the path of loving my body as it is, and just being okay with the journey and accepting myself as I am, but I also love how you said, it’s okay for me to want to change and have that preference and still work towards that. That’s good. And, um, and then all the stuff about emotional eating, I think is right on to so…

Marc David
You know, it sounds paradoxical but to me, if I could just wave my magic wand and change how your inner world works, what I would change is that, okay, you have your preference. And you’re learning how to love and accept your body as it is. And as you get stronger, and more secure, and more king like in, I accept myself, a king doesn’t sit on his throne and say why I really don’t accept myself because then he doesn’t accept his position, he doesn’t accept His authority, it doesn’t accept his own dignity, he doesn’t accept his own journey, doesn’t accept his own body. So it’s a king’s job to accept, here’s me, here’s my lot in life. Because as you accept that, then, if you want to go about the business, of changing something, you’re not changing it from a place of, I hate myself, this is not good enough, you’re not good enough, James, this has to shift, then you could love yourself. That voice is over. So more of you is actually available to the preference that you want. You have to me a better chance of getting there.

Because once that critic is largely decommissioned, the critics always gonna be there. It’s just about decommissioning it. So it has instead of, you know, 100% power, it has like five or 10% power, oh, there’s my inner critic, okay, whatever. Been there, done that. Not interested. I’m learning to love and accept this body as it is. That’s gives you a power because then your life doesn’t depend on shape shifting your body. Your happiness doesn’t depend on it. And even once you get there, once you get there, you will be more secure.

I think what’s happened to you in the past when you’ve been successful. You’ve gotten there and you’ve manipulated your body into becoming the body that you wanted, but the inner shifts really didn’t take hold for you. What I’m saying is, let’s do the inner shift first. And the inner shift is My preference will no longer be driven by self attack, self hate, self judgment, self criticism, I’m not good enough, I’m going to focus on I love and accept myself. So it’s almost like you’re, you’re putting the putting the challenge to yourself to create this body, putting it on hold, not thrown it out, you still want it, you still honor it still want to end. For now, I’m going to work on accepting this body as it is. And then see what shows up from there. See what gets in the way of that. Because that’s actually harder work. But then shape shifting the body, but it’s more sustainable. Once you get there, you’re going to feel good about yourself. And if your body changes, great, and you’ll be able to sustain it because you won’t have the critic in you that’s throwing you off balance and causing a certain kind of insecurity that, oh, as soon as I’m not feeling right, I’m reaching for food. And that overrides all my efforts. So I think if you’re gonna put first things first, to me first things first is how do I maybe for the first time learn to love and accept my body, which is really loving and accepting me?

And that’s, that’s an interesting journey.

James
It is. Yeah!

Marc David
So part of it is taking the stress off of your goal. Taking the immediacy from it. Taking the urgency from it. And taking some of the power from it that it doesn’t deserve. It’s a preference. And once you have that body, yeah, I like this. But it’s not life or death. It’s not emotional life or death. It’s not Soul Life or death. If you get it great if you sustain it great. And if you don’t, we’re good.

James
I love that! Yes.

Marc David
So are there times when you’re not at your ideal body that you just kind of forget about it all and you really enjoy being in your body?

James
Yeah, like I mentioned earlier, Italy was amazing, because I wasn’t. That was the farthest thing from my mind. I was enjoying… I was in Sicily and in Rome. And when I was in Rome by myself, I was just like, with myself, like enjoying the history. There was like no limits on the food. And honestly, I was walking so much and just enjoying, savoring every moment. There was never once that there was any voice going, Oh, you better not eat that. Don’t have a cannoli, you don’t have a gelato that was never happening. I was just loving it and just enjoying my time so much.

And there was like a, there was a whisper I would say like I mentioned I was I did walk a lot. I mean, one day I walked 15 miles because it’s just so much fun to walk around and so much to see. Like I couldn’t get enough. But I wasn’t doing that to off bounce the food. It was just like I would just wanted to see more experience as much as I could while I was there.

Marc David
I love it. Italy’s great for that by the way, did you gain weight when you were there?

James
No!

Marc David
Isn’t that interesting? Isn’t that’s very interesting….

James
It’s very interesting.

Marc David
It just proves that when you James are your most natural self. Your natural self is. Here I am. And I’m a guy that likes to enjoy life. In my purest expression. I love enjoying life. And you know something, I can enjoy life. I can enjoy my body. I can eat this. I can eat that, I could take a walk. I could take a long walk. I could just take it all in. And I’m good! This is good and your body stays where it is. It holds steady because it’s able to reach its highest expression because you personally are in your highest expression, which is, I’m free. I’m free of the encumbrances of eat this, eat that, you should stay away from this, maybe you need to exercise, you ate this. And when that dialogue is gone, what’s left? Is you being joyful. And what’s left is you discovering and what’s left is your body kind of treats you well. So it would be interesting to start to see how you can bring a little bit of that home to Los Angeles with you just just how you can kind of capture some of that state because it’s an inner state.

James
Yeah, I was so inspired and part of what I did you know, there’s so many museums and so much art and stuff to see and I had lost touch with how much I enjoyed doing that. And I really forgot like, oh, wait, LA has all these crazy museums. And so I went online and like, found some and I’m actually going to go to one this weekend, I like already have a ticket and everything to go see this Andy Warhol exhibit and artists who I’ve always loved. So I want to take more of that, because that was one of the key takeaways. I caught like pandemic mode. I was, you know, I worked from home, I was isolated a lot but I was like, in this foreign country, just exploring by myself, absolutely no problems. So any excuse is gone. Because, you can’t use that anymore. You went to a foreign country and traveled and did all this amazing stuff by yourself. Why can’t you do that? And because LA is so big, I could literally go to, you know, the valley and it’s like being in another country, not to disparage the valley, but you get what I’m saying, you know, so I do want to take that, I think I think you’re right on the money there.

James
Like I felt really alive, I felt really at peace. And just really enjoyed that time so much!

Marc David
That

Marc David
What you just described, I believe is what the biggest part of you believes will happen when you have the body that you want.

When I have the body that I want, I will have the life that I want. I think that’s the deeper wishing there the body that I want, that I desire, that’s my preference, will give me the life that I want.

James
That’s very perceptive. Because the thing that I also realized I told my my trainer at the gym, I was like, I didn’t make the like conscious connection, that I was withholding love to myself until I had achieved that body. I didn’t realize that what I was doing, but I that’s exactly what I was doing. I was putting it off and saying no, no, no, no, you can’t have that until you have achieved this body. And it’s just, it’s just nonsense.

Marc David
It is. It is nonsense, because you see you experienced that you can actually have the life that you want, without having the body that you want. And sure you can still want the body that you want fine, you just have other things you want to. So you can still have the life that you want. One is not dependent on the other. That’s the key.

That’s where you take back the power and then start to live the life you want that you imagine the body is going to give you. And part of that life is just allowing yourself to be free and allowing yourself to be the real you and saying I’m comfortable here. I feel good about myself. And I’m gonna be an open person and I’m gonna explore my creativity and I’m gonna explore my interests and my passions, and the things I’m drawn to. That sounds like your essence. You know, you just want to take in all the good things but I can only do that when I have the ideal body because then I deserve it. It sounds strange, right?

James
It does. It’s really strange. I don’t know how I got there I am but the beautiful thing is that, that was like it brings up so much emotion but I’m so grateful for that trip because it was able to give me that insight. And it’s really so great that it’s coinciding with this conversation as well. Because now, you’ve been able to really help me verbalize and visualize, like, okay, yeah, like, and we have some beautiful, great next steps and things that I can do. I’m really grateful.

Marc David
James, I’m grateful too! This has been such an excellent conversation. I think we covered a lot of good turf. And, you know, I just appreciate you and how you’ve been really active and aware and honest about your journey. And, you know, we’re all learning growing human beings, you know, we’re not doing anything wrong. We’re just trying to figure out like, how do I make it in this world and be a happy person, and feel like I’m living my best life and being my best self. And sometimes our ideas about the body, just our ideas, and our thoughts and our beliefs get in the way of being our best self.

James
100%!

Marc David
So, as soon as we can start to take that out of the way, and be like, Oh, okay I can live my best life and not have the perfect body or not have my ideal preference. And if I want, I can still work towards that preference.

So I think you got a good roadmap for yourself here.

James
I agree! Yes…

Marc David
James, thanks for a great conversation. I so appreciate it.

James
Thank you, Marc. This has been amazing. Appreciate it!

Marc David
All right. Take care everybody.