Weight Loss & Spiritual Growth: What’s the Connection – In Session with Marc David

Weight Loss & Spiritual Growth: What’s the Connection – In Session with Marc David

Marc David
Welcome, everybody. I’m Marc David, founder of the Institute for the Psychology of Eating. We are in the Psychology of Eating podcast, and I am with Carrie today. Welcome, Carrie.

Carrie
Thank you. Good to be here.

Marc David
Alright. Well, for anybody out there listening who’s new to the podcast, Carrie and I haven’t met, and we are here to have a session together to see if we can make some good things happen. So, Carrie, if you can wave your magic wand, and if you can get whatever you wanted with food and body, what would that be for you?

Carrie
Mmm… Peace.

Marc David
And what would you have peace from?

Carrie
Peace from feeling judgment from others. Peace just within myself, and forgiveness for mistakes of the past. Forgiveness in the moment. And being able to have the time, energy, and resources to fully nourish myself. And always. Not just with nutrition, but in all areas of my life.

Marc David
Understood. So when it comes to food and your eating, when it comes to your body, where are you with that?

Carrie
Well, recently, I’ve lost about 50 pounds. And that brings me to a total of almost 100 pounds that I’ve lost. The interesting thing that’s happening right now with me is that, with this recent weight loss — you know, people mention it. People talk about it: “Oh, you know, you look good. Oh, what are you doing?” And I find I’m very — I’m conflicted about that. You know, I feel good about losing the weight. It’s made me feel better. My health is better. But I feel a great deal of anger toward folks who are noticing it and commenting. Because it just feels so incredibly judgmental. I feel as though, you know, what they’re saying is, “Well, you were okay before, but you’re better now. And you know, if you lose even more weight, you’ll be even better.” I’m surprised at how difficult it is.

Marc David
Yes, yes. We’re going to talk about that in a little bit. Where are you at with your weight right now? Do you want to lose more?

Carrie
Um, yeah, eventually I would like to. But I also know enough about myself that, if I focus on that, then nothing happens. I have to be, you know, in that place of peace to be able to let go of the weight. I’ve carried it for a long, long time, for some very good reasons. And it’s not just a matter of, you know, going on a diet, or whatever. It’s a spiritual journey for me in many ways.

Marc David
So describe more to me, just so I can understand. When you say being more at peace, can you just say more about that? What’s the opposite of that for you, when you’re not in peace? What’s it feeling like? What does it sound like in your head?

Carrie
It feels like a lot of scarcity. I live in an area that, although it’s a rural agricultural area, is practically a food desert. So, you know, actually the mechanics of feeding myself well are difficult. It takes a lot of — you know, I’m an hour away from a grocery store that is halfway stocked well. And so that’s part of it. That’s kind of the physical part of it. But there’s just a lot of anxiety around that for me right now. Being in a relatively new area to me, leaving family and friends behind, has been hard. My values don’t align very well with values of the area that I live in now. That’s a struggle for me. I feel short on time. I just feel kind of keyed up and anxious. And scarcity is the word, really. Not only of food, but time, energy, resources.

Marc David
What made you move to the area that you’re living in now?

Carrie
Well, I moved here for a job, which is something I never thought I would do. And my job is challenging. I like it. Actually, I work at a monastery, a women’s Benedictine monastery, which is kind of a — I mean, that’s a big change. But we’re sort of a little enclave here in this community. I feel supported by the people there as individuals. But beyond that, there isn’t much community for me here. And part of that’s my own fault.

Marc David
So is that a job you think you’re gonna stay in for a while?

Carrie
For a while, yeah. Yep. I’m close to retirement. I don’t know what that means. But I’ll be here for at least a little while longer.

Marc David
So it sounds like — so how long have you been in this new area?

Carrie
Four and a half years.

Marc David
Four and a half years? Okay, so it’s not so new anymore.

Carrie
No.

Marc David
Okay. And in your ideal world, how much weight would you lose?

Carrie
Oh, wow. I’d lose — hmm. That’s a hard question. I’d like to lose another 50 pounds or so.

Marc David
Okay. So if you lost that other 50 pounds — do you know like, approximately, what weight would that put you at?

Carrie
That would put me close to 200.

Marc David
When was the last time you were at 200?

Carrie
Oh, lordy. I don’t even know. It’s been a long time.

Marc David
Yeah. And let’s say you lost that 50 pounds, you’re at 200. How do you imagine things are going to be different for you? Like, what would feel different? What would be different?

Carrie
Well, I would be more active. I used to be quite an outdoors person and, you know, did hiking and skiing and things like that, bicycling. Which are difficult for me now. They’re getting easier. And that’s something that I’m starting to get back into, because I know that I can. You know, there’s nothing stopping me now. But it would just be easier to move in the world, frankly.

Marc David
So if you lost the weight, it would be easier to move, which makes it easier for you to sort of be a more active outdoorsy person. That’ll be fun.

Carrie
Yeah. And I feel like being able to do more of the outdoorsy things would — it’s kind of going back to who I truly am. I have felt like the last, like, 20 years or so, I’ve just put myself on hold and have not been my true self. I’ve been hiding.

Marc David
Tell me more about your true self. This sounds very interesting. Who is this true self that’s not being fully expressed right now?

Carrie
Um, like doing the kinds of physical activities that I’ve talked about. Being more comfortable in social situations. I have a passion for a primary school in Kenya, and I haven’t been there for a long time. I’d love to get back there. Just being more confident, I think. Better able to express myself.

Marc David
So in your mind, and I just want to understand your thinking — the thinking is, you know, “If I lose this weight, I’m going to be being more the real me.” One of those things means, you know, greater ease of movement. And another aspect is, “I’ll feel more confident. And feeling more confident will have me doing certain things that I really want to do,” which is, you know, put more time and energy to this passion project that you have in Kenya. And just feeling more confident about yourself. Am I saying that right? Does that [inaudible] true?

Carrie
Yeah, and I think that the thing that lies beneath all of that really is the spiritual journey part of it. The part of it that is healing myself, healing my soul. And by doing that, you know, then I can more fully express myself. That make sense?

Marc David
I think so. But I want to understand better. So there’s a part of this weight loss journey for you, that feels like it’s also a spiritual journey. And what I’m not clear about is, what about it feels like a spiritual journey? What about this weight loss journey will help you feel like you’re arriving more, and that you’re getting to this place of spiritual growth?

Carrie
Well, I think that the weight has been a way to protect myself from — it’s a paradox. Because not only does it protect me from other people. It also keeps me away from other people. My weight has kept me safe in many ways. And so the weight is really the result of that — I don’t know how to say it, but — damage to my soul. And as my soul heals, then, you know, the weight will drop. It’s dropped before. And I feel like, as I do, you know, fill that hole in my soul, it’ll continue to drop.

Marc David
Got it. So. No, thank you for explaining that.

Carrie
Yeah, it’s hard to put into words.

Marc David
So when did you first notice that that weight was a challenge for you?

Carrie
When I was very, very young. Like, maybe four or five.

Marc David
And what alerted you to the fact that weight was a concern?

Carrie
Um, kids would make fun of me. My parents put me on — there was a product called Ayds candy, you know, that was supposed to suppress your appetite. And when I was — I think I must have been four or five, my parents got me that candy. And, you know, I always felt like I was being told that I was fat. When looking back at pictures of myself, I was a stocky kid. There’s no doubt about that. But fat? Come on. My dad struggled with his weight all his life. And I think that was a big part of it — that he was, you know, he didn’t want me to go through the trials and tribulations that he had. And I was instantly resentful. I remember purposefully eating Oreos because I was mad, because of something that, you know, my parents had said to me. So it goes way, way, way, way, way, way back.

Marc David
So kids teased you. That alerted you: “Okay, there’s something about my weight that people don’t quite approve of.” Parents start to notice that, and they’re trying to do things so you don’t get fat, or get more fat, or go through what they went through. How did your mother deal with all this?

Carrie
Um, she was the one who would talk about it. My dad never said anything. But, you know, as an adult — well, he did as I was an adult. But as a little kid, it was my mom who was after me. And she was not particularly loving, or demonstrative in a loving way.

Marc David
So was there ever a point in your life, in your journey, where you weighed an amount that you looked in the mirror and said, “I like this. I feel good about myself.” When was that?

Carrie
Yeah. Yes. In high school, and a little beyond high school. Say, between the ages of about 16, to 22 or 23.

Marc David
And then after that, you weren’t so happy weight came on?

Carrie
Yes. From that point on, from my early 20s, I just continually and steadily gained weight over many years.

Marc David
Are you in a relationship?

Carrie
No.

Marc David
Have you been married?

Carrie
No.

Marc David
Kids?

Carrie
No.

Marc David
What would you like the future to be for you, in terms of friendship? Relationship?

Carrie
I have a group of very good, very close, long-term friends, that — you know, we’re separated by distance now. But they’re there. And I love friendships. I have other friendships that are very close that are not — people I don’t see very often. But that core group is really important to me. And I hope that that continues. As far as the relationship goes, I don’t know. It seems like companionship would be nice. But I’m not — I don’t really know. It’s been a long time. I did in my — you know, as I was younger, I dated and had a couple of good relationships. I was engaged, actually twice. But since for the last, probably 30 years or so, I haven’t been in a close relationship, romantic relationship.

Marc David
So you were engaged twice. So that’s [inaudible] came close to making a long-term commitment to somebody. So I’m just imagining, in my mind, going from that, to not really engaging that deeply for the next three decades. That’s a big shift.

Carrie
Yes, it is. And the first engagement, when it broke off, I was heartbroken. And very — I felt like it was my fault. And in later years, I found out it wasn’t really my fault. It was nobody’s fault. And actually, I have remained friends with that person all these years, and he’s one of my closest friends. It just was –marriage was just not the right relationship for us.

Marc David
So, what did you tell yourself after the second engagement broke off? What did you tell yourself about relationship and what you wanted? And where you were at? [inaudible] something to yourself.

Carrie
Well, I think I felt very flawed. And that, you know, it just wasn’t something that was possible for me. Because of this flaw that I had. Which is, you know, from my perspective here, at this point in my life, is ridiculous. But I believed that pretty deeply at the time.

Marc David
Yeah, that’s understandable. You know, if this has happened twice to me, and if it was my fault, then clearly something’s wrong with me. So I’m flawed. So I can’t have this.

Carrie
Right.

Marc David
So, how did you feel about your body, when you were in your 30s and 40s?

Carrie
Um, not good. I felt like — when the first engagement was broken, I felt like at least a large part of the reason was my body. That my body wasn’t enough. And I — you know, you asked the question, and I’ve never really thought about it. But I suspect I’ve felt that way ever since.

Marc David
What do you think led you to the conclusion: “My body wasn’t enough in this relationship?”

Carrie
Well, what happened was that the man I was engaged to came out as gay. I think he had an inkling before we became engaged. I think he just didn’t know what to do with that. And when he sort of figured out, “wait, there’s just no way I can do this,” he wisely broke it off. However, that’s when I felt like it was my fault. I was not woman enough to keep him.

Marc David
Got it. How does it feel when you say that right now?

Carrie
I can’t believe I just said it out loud.

Marc David
No, that’s very sweet. That’s very honest. Because that is a legitimate conclusion for a young person to make.

Carrie
But it wasn’t until many years later that I found out that — I met other women, who had been in the same circumstance. And it finally — you know, it was like, “Oh, my gosh, you mean, it’s not my fault?” It’s very weird. But that’s how it was for me at that time. I didn’t know anything. you know. I just figured — obviously, I’m just not enough.

Marc David
You know, I think it’s easy — when we have that false belief, “I’m not enough. I’m not lovable as I am” — it’s easy for that to translate into any aspect of our life.

Carrie
Exactly.

Marc David
You got that message from a young age. Four or five years old. You were getting it from your peers. How do kids come out so mean, you know?

Carrie
I know, that’s a good question, huh?

Marc David
Kids are so innocent and sweet and can also be so terribly mean. So you got the message from a young age, from your peers — like, you and your body are not enough. We don’t separate those two. We’re not smart enough. We’re not wise enough to separate, “you don’t like my body,” with “you don’t like me.” There is something wrong with my body; therefore, there’s something wrong with me. Something wrong with my body, something wrong with my soul. So we can’t tease those apart at a young age.

Marc David
And honestly, it’s hard to tease apart as we get older, because the belief is so ingrained, and it’s so deep. Especially if your parents then reinforced that belief. They were trying to do the opposite. They were trying to do whatever they could do to help you have a life where you feel loved. But unfortunately, they weren’t smart enough. And most parents aren’t smart enough to navigate these waters. And however they acted towards you gave you the message: “You’re not enough.” And you rebelled. So there’s a part of you that’s a real rebel.

Carrie
Yep, absolutely.

Marc David
And there’s a part of you that basically is saying — you know, “Don’t tell me what to do, don’t tell me what to eat.” And that, by the way, is a very healthy part of us. Especially to have that part born in you at a young age. Because a child’s mind isn’t smart enough to say, “Wait a second, this isn’t the right parenting that I need. This is not the right adulting that I need. I need to somehow find my own inner strength and wisdom.” All the child really knows is: “No. Something wrong here. I ain’t doing this.” That’s about the wisdom of a child’s mind. It’s just — if we’re lucky, we go, “No.” So that’s the little rebel in you.

Carrie
That’s my favorite part of me.

Marc David
Yes, and it’s a good part of you, because the rebel has a lot of power. Rebel has a lot of strength. The rebel is interesting. And the rebel can inspire you to do all kinds of good things. You know, Gandhi was a rebel. Martin Luther King was a rebel. Mother Teresa was a rebel. All kinds of famous rebels out there. So here’s something I would like to consider you revisiting. And you made a statement a while ago that, you know, that there’s something you’re trying to heal in your soul. And if you could heal your soul, then you’re going to lose the weight. How do you know? Because the weight came off in the past. So what I’m hearing is that you’re equating this thing we’re calling soul-healing, with weight coming off. And I don’t know that that is a legitimate assessment for you to make, that soul healing equals weight loss, one-to-one mapping: “when I lose weight — I mean, when my soul heals, my weight comes off. Period.” That may be true. I’m not saying it’s not true. But I don’t think it’s an absolute truism. I think all kinds of people can have all kinds of soul healing, and they still have unwanted challenges. They still might have unwanted weight. They still might have cancer, they still might have — you name it. Even though soul healing can happen. I’ve watched a lot of my relatives do some soul healing, and then die.

Carrie
Yes, yeah. Yeah. Right.

Marc David
So I just might, my little caution light comes on when you say that. Because, to me what it is, is — here’s one way to frame it: You have a preference to weigh less. You don’t have to give anybody any reason why you would want to weigh less. You don’t have to give me a reason, your friends a reason — anybody. It’s your preference. I see you wearing green. I like that color. I like the red. That’s your preference. My preference too. Might not be somebody else’s preference. Me and you? We don’t care. You like it. As long as I’m good with it, we’re in a nice, smooth, easy conversation. So we have our preferences, and we don’t have to justify them. We don’t have to couple our preferences. Well, I want to wear green today because it means I’m growing and expanding. No, you just — you like it.

Carrie
Right. Okay.

Marc David
I do what I like. So, I would like to see you decouple weight loss from soul-healing. Not that you don’t want to do soul healing. I think that’s great. I think that’s wonderful and beautiful, and honorable, to continue to do work on oneself, and to do deep work on oneself. But I don’t think it’s fair to you to couple those two together. It puts too much pressure on you. It puts pressure on your body. And it’s basically telling your body: “If you don’t lose weight, that means I’m not okay.” That’s the reverse message.

Carrie
Right, right. I can hear that, as you’re saying that. It’s another way of saying I’m not enough.

Marc David
Yep.

Carrie
Okay. Yeah. Interesting.

Marc David
So, in an ideal universe, you’re enough. Period.

Carrie
Right, right.

Marc David
You’re enough, period. And you have your preference. Yeah, I want to be around closer friends. Yeah, I want to have healthier food around me. I want to have better choices around that. It’s a legitimate preference. I get it. I want to have a body that weighs less. Preference. I get it. Why? You feel lighter, feel good, feel more confident. Great. Preference. But it doesn’t say anything about your value or your worthiness or the health of your soul. So really, when we do that, we’re basically doing the thing that would have been ideal, if we could have waved our magic wand in our childhood and somehow told little Carrie, “Guess what. You are so amazingly lovable as you are. You don’t have to do anything else. You’re great. You’re lovable. You’ll find love. You’ll have love. All kinds of love. Why? Because you’re you. Because you’re a good person. Because you do your best. It’s got nothing to do with your body. All different kinds of people. All different kinds of bodies. All different kinds of people like all different kinds of bodies.

What happens is, we take the insult that we heard, we take the false statements, and we absorb them. And then we replay them to ourselves: “Okay. So I was told by the outside that I’m not enough as I am. I got to lose this weight.” So now you’ve invented a reason why you need to lose the weight, in order to be more lovable. So it’s the adult version. It’s today’s version of the old, “you’re not enough.”

Carrie
Yeah, that makes sense.

Marc David
So it’s turning it around. Making weight loss as preference, that you don’t have to explain to anybody. And by the way, when you mentioned earlier — you know, it’s this weird thing, because I lose weight and everybody’s like, “Oh, you look so great.” Well, what’s the implication? Does that mean I didn’t look great before, and if I lose more weight, then I’m going to look better? So that’s because that’s what you’re thinking.

Carrie
Yeah. Yeah.

Marc David
People are just — maybe they mean that, and maybe they don’t. It doesn’t even matter. But really, if you’ve got a little hook for that, if you’re the kind of gal that’s saying to yourself, “Yeah, I look better. I like this me more — well, yeah. So other people are gonna say that. You’re saying it, they’re saying it.

Carrie
Right. Yeah, that really makes sense. So I know everyone who said that to me, was well intentioned. I know them. Yeah. None of that was said out of anger or spite, or whatever. But that’s how I heard it.

Marc David
Right. Because it’s alerting you that there’s a part of you that still has the old booboo called, “Ah, see you lost weight? You’re better now. You’re more lovable now. You’re more okay now.” Now, here’s the double whammy for you. Here’s why your journey is kind of extra challenging, is because you’re in a relationship where the engagement broke off, because the man realized he has a different sexual preference. And perfectly understandable for you to then make up the story: “If I was a woman enough, that wouldn’t have happened.” So it’s taking the old booboo, “My body’s not good enough,” and looking for evidence out there to prove the booboo. That’s what we do with our booboos. We look for evidence to prove, “See? I’m no good, because that happened.” And you’ve learned — no, not your fault. Not your fault at all. In fact, you were probably woman enough, such that you were able to draw in a man who wasn’t quite sure where he was landing, and he’s like, “Okay, here’s somebody. Here’s somebody pretty good.” So if anything, you could look at it as the opposite.

Carrie
That’s funny. I’ll have to tell him that.

Marc David
That you were you woman enough to kind of pull him towards the dark side, so to speak.

Carrie
Yeah. Oh, he’ll love that. We’ll get a good laugh out of that.

Marc David
Yeah. So this is about you calling a ceasefire on your body shape shifting, making you a more healed person, or a better person. You’re there. You’re there, meaning you’re Carrie. You’re great. You’ve done a lot of work on yourself. There’s more things you want to do in your life. And yeah, there’s certain ways that a bigger body can limit us. But with you, it’s gonna be a little tricky, because the old booboo is telling you, “Well you can’t be the real you, until –.” So the reality is, theoretically, you can be more confident now. Why? Because you’re you. You’re a great lady. You’re a wonderful human being. You’re a great rebel. You forge your own path. You’ve had some challenging times, and you’re your own person. You have every good reason to feel confident about yourself, and all you have to do is decide, ” I have every good reason to feel confident about myself.”

Part of not feeling like I have enough energy — part of it, is when our thoughts are heavy. You know that. You can wake up on the right side of the bed, and you got energy. For whatever reason, you woke up feeling good, you got energy. And there’s times when we’re thinking thoughts that aren’t so good, and we’re heavy. The skinniest people can be some of the heaviest people, depending on what’s going on in their inner world. So there’s a little bit for you, where the old heaviness of this burden of, “I’ve got to lose weight. I’ve got to be…” There’s also probably something tied in with it, for you, about your womanhood.

So I think a piece of the puzzle is you starting fresh, and reinventing what it means for Carrie to be a woman because you don’t have to follow anybody’s rules. Because you’re a rebel. You can make up your own rules. And what does it mean for you to be a woman? What kind of woman do you want to be? Forget about what anybody else said, and forget about what society — so forget about it all. Who’s the woman that you want to be? Because you’re a woman. And I bet, if you polled your friends — this might be a very interesting homework assignment. Poll all your friends. Tell them this guy you talked to you on a podcast gave you a homework assignment. And say — all they need to do is write you a letter where they’re saying, in the positive, all the positive ways that they see you as a woman. And then listen. See what the feedback is.

Carrie
Okay.

Marc David
Oftentimes, the people closest to us know us really well, and have some good feedback for us. I think it would be really nourishing for you, to hear how you show up in the world as a woman. From people that know you.

Carrie
Okay, I’ll do that.

Marc David
And to notice — and this is a little work, but to notice where you need to forgive yourself for imaginary crimes. “I wasn’t enough of a woman.” Forgiven. Not guilty. No crime committed. In fact, you were probably a lot of woman. And that probably helped your partner see, “Oh, I gotta do something different.” There’s a strange hidden compliment in there.

Carrie
Yeah. Yeah.

Marc David
But I think as you redefine yourself as a woman, whatever that means for you — what does it mean to you to be a woman? What does it mean to be a woman in friendship? What does it means to be a woman in your physicality? In your sensuality? in your sexuality? And ask yourself those questions, and be willing to just explore in your own mind what your honest-to-goodness inclinations or desires or curiosities are. Without saying, “But, but, but… But I can’t do that because….” You have no idea what’s possible for you. In the positive. What happens is, people — and I find women will do this, particularly around weight. Women can use weight — and men will do it too — use my weight to protect myself from my own sexuality and sensuality.

And you’re an adult, and you get to invent what that is for you — what your sexuality and sensuality is to you. But in order to do that, you just have to dream about it. You have to think about it. You have to explore, in your mind first, without, “But how am I going to create this? But how am I going to make this happen? Because I’m in the middle of Idaho. All that kind of nonsense.” That’s not your job to figure out “How is it all going to work?” Your job is to figure out who you are, and what you like, and what you desire, and what your preferences are. And what your curiosities are.

Then you’re not waiting. Your body’s happening right now. To find peace, the peace that you’re looking for — I think a big part of that peace is, you finally just embracing this body. Having even a moment where you just welcome her: “Come on home. You are accepted as you are. You don’t have to look a damn bit different. You don’t have to weigh any different.” There is no attachment here. Your soul is all good. Nothing wrong with your soul. You’re growing. Just because there’s places where you need to grow doesn’t mean there’s something wrong with you. We’re all growing. Nothing’s broken here.

What’s happening for you, Carrie? What are you thinking and feeling?

Carrie
I’m trying not to cry.

Marc David
You can cry. It’s all good.

Carrie
Well, I — this has been very helpful. And it just lands like such truth, that that’s what brings the tears, you know. I love the idea of of asking myself those questions about, who am I as a woman? I’ve never done that before. And I love the idea of asking my friends. I’ve asked them a similar question before and did receive just tons of really positive comments that — you know, I still live on those a little bit. And to be able to decouple my body and my spirituality is just a huge, huge, huge shift too. There’s a lot here.

Marc David
Yes. Yeah. You can totally just forgive your body, and just welcome her home. If any of your friends, any of the people that you cared about, came to you and said, “Carrie, I’ve just been hating on my body, and it just doesn’t feel good. I’m trying to change it. I just need a little help,” you’d give them a big hug.

Carrie
Absolutely. Yeah.

Marc David
You would let them know, on every level, that you love and accept them, and they don’t have to be any different. That’s what you would do. So all I’m saying is, that’s what you do for yourself. And it sounds so cliche, but it’s so true. Because we’re really experts at helping others, oftentimes. And when it comes to ourselves, giving ourselves the same goodness that we give to others, inherently, for whatever reason, how God made us — that’s just not as easy. But that’s our task, oftentimes.

So it’s forgiving your body, for the first time ever acknowledging over here that — yeah, you have a preference to lose weight. But it’s a preference. It’s not, “Well, if you’re gonna lose weight, then I don’t like you, and you’re no good, and you’ll never whatever, whatever, whatever.” No. Just my preference. And here’s my starting point. This body — you know, I just wanted to mention one other thing. You talked about how, you know, perhaps on some level, you’ve used your body to create protection. And we often do that. The body often does that the body will often get bigger to protect us, to shield us, to isolate us. And also, the body gets bigger to help us ground, and help us be here. Oftentimes, it does that.

So there’s a nice reframe in there for you that, “Right now, this body helps me ground. It helps me be here. It’s keeping me here.” Because there’s a part of us that wants to go sometimes. What do I dislike so much? I didn’t get what I want. Hasn’t been easy. I’ve had pains. I’ve had disappointments. And it’s easy to have one foot out the door. We don’t kill ourselves, but we’re not fully living our life. And sometimes a bigger body just anchors us here. And just says, “You’re here on Earth. You ain’t going anywhere yet.” So part of it is deciding that you really want to be here. And you want to live your life. And that your life is good, and it will be good. And yeah, you’d like to change your body. Okay, great. Do you like to have better food. Great. All kinds of preferences. Great.

But here’s your body. And in the comfort of your own home, you could just totally dig it, and love it, and be grateful that you got it. And you can remember in the back of your mind, “Yeah, my body can shapeshift. It’s done so in the past.” Body’s pretty amazing that way. But I think, for you, at this stage of the game, it’s not changing your body, so I can feel better about myself and feel better about being here. It’s feeling better about being here now. First. Because then your body’s going to feel safe. A safer body will be willing to be a lighter body. If body not safe, body want to be bigger.

Carrie
Yeah. That really resonates. Especially in my kind of unwillingness to be where I am right now.

Marc David
Yeah. So that’s just a great awareness. And it’s just time to be just swimmingly willing. Just absolutely willing. Like, “Yeah, this is exactly where I’m at.” What a beautiful starting point. There’s a beauty in that. Because you’re starting over, inside. And we don’t know where it’s gonna go. We don’t know where your body is gonna go. Life is a mystery. And you’ve been in a mystery your whole life. You’ve been learning your whole life. And this is a new way to go about being in relationship with your body, and being in relationship with your life. You’re not waiting for approval from you, or anyone else, to move forward. You’re not waiting for your body to change. As soon as you approve of your body, it has what it wants.

Carrie
Ah.

Marc David
It can relax. Just like you did. You took a deep breath.

Carrie
I did, didn’t I? Yeah, that’s a whole new way of thinking. For me

Marc David
Yeah. We did some good work today, Carrie.

Carrie
Absolutely. I’m so grateful.

Marc David
I’m grateful too. This was an amazing conversation. And I’m really glad you hung in there. And we covered some really good territory. I think there’s just a lot of juicy nuggets in here for you, so I’m super happy for you.

Carrie
Yeah. Well, thank you so much. It’s been a real gift.

Marc David
Thanks so much, Carrie. I appreciate you.

Carrie
Yeah, me too. You too. Take care.

Marc David
You too. Thanks, everybody for tuning in.

Carrie
Bye